Highlights from Eric’s Conversation

Tell me about your youth. Where did you grow up, and what lessons do you remember being taught that influenced your life?

I grew up in a rural area (southern Indiana) where everybody treated each other with respect as long as you treated other people with respect. It was a farming community, so I learned the value of hard work.

I spent my whole life wanting to be somebody. And I wanted to have things because I grew up poor. I remember there were nights I'd go to bed not knowing if I'd eat the next day.

There was a lot of food insecurity there at the time. I remember during the winter, in order for me to be comfortable eating breakfast before school, my mom would turn on the oven and open the door to heat the kitchen. 

I wanted to experience the city. I wanted to, you know, eat fancy food. You know, I didn't want breaded tenderloins every Friday night and fried chicken every Saturday.

What societal or cultural expectations do you feel challenged by in your current life? What are the “shoulds” you feel in daily life?

I think a lot of it is related to my profession. As a physician, you're expected to dress a certain way. You're supposed to look a certain way. You're supposed to approach people a certain way. The doctor should have the answer all the time. The doctor should be able to approach you objectively without being emotional. That's hard. 

So it's this myth of psychological invulnerability that I have to battle every day. The fact that I am not omniscient, I'm not infallible, I make mistakes. 

What do you think that trying to meet other people’s expectations has kept you from doing in life?

I'll tell you this is gonna sound weird and it's gonna sound remarkably superficial: drinking in public. I had to be really careful with how I couldn't totally be me in that environment because I like to have a bourbon and coke with my friends. But I knew if I did that It wouldn't be long before boy, “Knabel was out and really boozing it up. That guy can't that guy can't control himself.”

If I go to a Concert, I'm at a festival, and I'm in a mosh pit… is one of my patients going to see me? Is this gonna end up on Facebook?

If you could immediately release yourself from three shoulds in your life without any negative consequences, what would those be?

I'd like to be able to take a vacation without guilt 

I've recognized the need especially as I've gotten older of I need space I need the space to be emotional

You Know I'd like to be I'd like to be released from people's expectations that I'm busy or that I don't have time … You are not wasting my time. If anything you're justifying my existence,

You should act your age. Because I get that a lot too, you know, I still go to concerts. I still enjoy doing things I was doing in my 20s. Why can't we normalize 50 year olds getting tattoos?

If you imagine a life where you were living with complete support, not just for who you are but for the exploration of who you are and who you are becoming, what does that look like and what does that feel like?

I would love to be able to be free of the monetary value of what I do. I would love to know that all of my basic needs and maybe even a few of my luxuries are handled. 

My ideal world is I don't spend any time thinking how much it costs or how much time it's going to take or who's going to miss out because I'm doing something for me.

Is there anything else that you want to impart from your life wisdom to those struggling with the weight of shoulds and attempts to be freely and authentically themselves?

I'm a big fan of the poem, The Man in the Glass. I remember the last line is something, you may travel the pathway of years and get pats on the back as you pass, but your final reward will be heartache and pain if you've cheated the man in the glass.

And I think, I tell people all the time, treat yourself as well as you would want others to treat you. Would you talk to yourself in a way that you wouldn't let someone talk to your friend? 

I think it's find a path to the point where you feel the most comfortable in your own skin, and only then you can be your most authentic self. Because there's so much, so much unhappiness comes from people living other people's dreams, or trying to live up to other people's expectations, and it just doesn't work. I've tried.

Bonus Questions

What song or songs do you listen to that make you feel powerful and free?

If I can dream by Elvis. Fox on the Run by Sweet. The Ace of Spades by Motorhead. I've been getting into The Grateful Dead a lot lately. The Safety Dance. if you want to see unbelievable energy for me from a surprising source, put on Dancing Queen from ABBA.

Describe an outfit that would make you feel all the ways you want to feel

That one's hard because there is no one outfit that defines me. How about a tuxedo with a spike belt and a spike bracelet. Or, you know, maybe a sleeveless lab coat with my tattoos hanging out. An Amazon Alexa in every room playing my favorite music, you know, feeling the music of my soul.

(If you have one) What is a favorite quote of yours?

Methods are many, principles are few. Methods always change, principles never do.

The person who knows how will always take a back seat to the person who knows why. 

You live for the fight when that's all that you've got.

Random Notable Quotes

• But I've also learned the closer you are to your patients the more they're going to confide in you. Nobody wants to confess their sins to an android. When we're distant, we're not likable.

• I've been to more concerts in the past year than I have in the past five, and it's because my closest friend growing up died of a heart attack at 51. Another person from my inner circle died of liver failure New Year's Eve, and, you know, I lost my dog. I lost my favorite in-law, who's a retired ER physician…I've just experienced this profound sense of loss in the last 18 months, You talk about shoulds, you know, but I call them my some days. I'm tired of saying someday, someday I'll do this, someday I'll do this. Why are we waiting? 
  

• I won't give up finding me. I still don't know who I am. That's the beautiful part. But I keep looking, you know. [Lisa: So, there you go. You keep on becoming.] That's right. I am becoming.